■ Appearance: Kyung-Min Kim / Professor Emeritus of Political Science and International Relations, Hanyang University
* The text below may differ from the actual broadcast content, so please check the broadcast for more accurate content.
[앵커]
It was President Yun Seok-yeol’s debut in multilateral diplomacy. The leaders of South Korea and Japan met several times at the NATO summit. First of all, it is evaluated that the first meeting was friendly. However, the reality is that difficulties between the two countries, such as a solution to forced labor, are piling up. Let’s talk to the experts. Kyung-Min Kim is Professor Emeritus of Political Science and International Relations at Hanyang University. welcome.
[김경민]
hello.
[앵커]
Talking about the NATO meeting, what do you think is the biggest achievement?
[김경민]
It is truly historic that Korea was invited to the collective security system called NATO. It is not unusual for us to be invited to NATO, the world’s most powerful collective security system in our country’s past history.
From now on, I will go ahead and greet the heads of state face-to-face, but we have no choice but to meet briefly. However, our country should invite all NATO leaders to our country individually over time.
I couldn’t have a deep conversation with the situation in which such a relationship was formed, so we have to invite the heads of individual countries to our country. So, if there is a business that needs to be further deepened and there is a project that needs to be done in reality, it was a very good opportunity to talk more concretely.
[앵커]
Laid the cornerstone for cooperation with NATO, can it be expressed in this way?
[김경민]
That’s right.
[앵커]
Not only Korea, but also Japan and Australia were invited as partners in the Asia-Pacific region. What does this mean?
[김경민]
First of all, the demand from the US has been great. Because the U.S. is keeping China in check, the stamina runs in keeping China in check. If China is looking at the map of China now, if an American aircraft carrier on the right coast of China was the same as in the past, China had no choice but to enter the Taiwan Strait.
But now, not only in the Taiwan Strait, but also in Okinawa, missiles capable of attacking US aircraft carriers are deployed. So even though the US has 10 to 11 aircraft carriers, depending on the construction period, more than 60% of them are deployed in the Pacific.
Nevertheless, it is now too late to handle this alone. That’s why Korea and Japan are deploying the military, so naturally, we should cooperate more and more, but Australia and New Zealand were trying to get cooperation to keep China in check on this side of the Western Pacific in solidarity.
[앵커]
If the purpose of China is to contain China, it is inevitable that China will be inconvenient. So, in some ways, this participation in the NATO summit poses a risk to China, and there are concerns.
[김경민]
There is nothing without risk in all diplomacy. But what does it matter? So, we have to look at external factors and internal factors. The external factor is that we are stationed in the U.S. military for the first time, which we do not see.
In the field where the US military is stationed, the US asks to attend NATO, but we can’t go, because of China. I can’t talk like this. However, economically, we have to exchange economic profits with China, so we have to do economic exchanges with China. it should disappear.
Because where our country occupies in the world right now, it is not in line with our international status to see China too much and do nothing about what diplomacy is doing against our national interest in this way or that. We need to instill confidence in our country’s international status, especially for young people. I think so.
[앵커]
However, there are also views like this, that the post-Cold War era has ended and the new Cold War era has begun over this NATO meeting.
[김경민]
Especially when Russia invaded Ukraine. China’s containment has been around for a long time, and since they’re attacking Ukraine this time, Europe is helping Ukraine a lot there militarily.
Rather than doing this in the name of NATO in order not to escalate the war, the Europeans and the Union European Unions individually united in one voice and Russia invaded Ukraine, and many people are dying now.
So, a new Cold War system is here, but from this perspective, the world has lived in peace since the end of World War II in 1945. Looking at it from there, it went through the Cold War era, but in the end, the country that values liberal democracy has won. That is why it is important to keep the norm of that precious value.
[앵커]
This time, the meeting was expressed as a solidarity of values, but if we narrow it down to Korea-Japan relations, we heard that the leaders of the two countries met four or five times during this meeting, and the atmosphere was not bad.
[김경민]
Prime Minister Kishida has an election for the House of Councilors of Japan on July 20th, but there was no specific meeting between Korea and Japan this time. However, since Prime Minister Kishida seems to have sent several messages from our side, let’s improve relations between Korea and Japan.
So, the expression was not bad. I see it this way, but after the House of Councilors election, I would like to make an effort to promote the summit between Korea and Japan in earnest.
[앵커]
Do you think you can go to a stage where that condition is created to some extent?
[김경민]
Relations between Korea and Japan are difficult. But we can’t do anything unless we take bold diplomatic steps. For example, the issue of comfort women, the issue of forced labor, and the sale of Mitsubishi Heavy Industries’ assets are currently pending in court.
However, in Japan, each country has a different way of apologizing. In Japan, even when they apologize, if they make a mistake, the executives will come out and say that they made a mistake at a 90-degree angle from the table, and it goes away.
Germany sentenced him to 5 years in prison for saying he had a 101-year-old man detained in a concentration camp for his WWII wrongdoings. There is a new museum where the Jews were slaughtered in front of Brandenburg, the main gate of the German capital of Berlin.
So I asked the Germans. Then they had no choice but to do so, and they did. Kindergarten kids showed it all. But the children were bored and wanted to die. ‘Cause it shows so much So, there are different ways to apologize.
So, when interacting with Japan, Japanese people apologize. There was the Kono discourse and there was the Murayama discourse. You can’t do anything beyond that level. It is a country that is a bit narrow in that regard.
I’m going to talk about what I did wrong and I’ll go with real pacifism. If it comes out like this, we’ll do it in a tone down in Korea too, but he said he apologized by twisting the words so strangely, adding ambiguous characters and writing incomprehensible characters. From my point of view, I want a big apology.
[앵커]
This is an apology that doesn’t feel sincere.
[김경민]
That’s the Japanese way of apology, the original way. I was taught at Waseda University in Japan and I was like that, but looking into Japanese culture, the way of apologizing is also different. So, in this regard, Japan is the only country in Korea that looks like that.
So, let’s face the history of that part, we’ll have to drag this part out. So that you guys don’t start the war of aggression again. There was also the Imjin War in the past. You have to plant that. There are so many things that need to be planted to be future-oriented, and there are too many things to cooperate with.
And again America wants it. Right now, the US is putting a lot of pressure on Korea-Japan relations to improve. In this respect, Korea-Japan relations must improve.
[앵커]
In reality, there is that aspect, but even if cultural differences in the way of apology are put aside, if the public sentiment does not accept it, in Korea. It is also a difficult problem, so how to solve this problem seems to be left as a fairly difficult task, and President Yoon Seok-yeol said this time, the task between Korea and Japan, that is, the problem of the past and the problem of the future, should be put on the same table. What does this mean?
[김경민]
So, if President Yoon meets with Prime Minister Kishida and holds a summit meeting about the past, he cannot not talk about the past at all, because there is a sentiment in the Korean people. However, from the Japanese point of view, they have done enough to apologize.
[앵커]
Is there any chance that something more advanced will come out?
[김경민]
I don’t think there is. I don’t think there is, but the Japanese people’s sentiment is too bad here for the sale of Japanese assets in Korea. So, regarding the comfort women issue, I talked a lot about how to solve the comfort women issue even when I appeared on YTN a long time ago.
Diplomacy shouldn’t do that kind of diplomacy. Our country was under colonial rule because our country mismanaged the country in the past, and we went through an unfair and difficult time. We are living well now.
So, I think it’s right for us to do the same thing by providing comfort women with sufficient medical benefits and living in good facilities with Korean money. Then the Japanese would be ashamed of themselves.
Our country comes forward and they do it or they don’t. To honor them is that the people of our country worked hard and lived well.
So, as we do that and our comfort women don’t die and live for a long time, a time like this is coming. It is true that our people are unraveling that unfortunate history. Then, if you depend too much on Japan, which is still blaming you for decades, you will be asked to make a proper apology, and the issue of Korea-Japan relations will continue to be complicated. I think we should rather take the initiative, I think.
[앵커]
Also, each professor may have different opinions on how to untie the knot in the past, and he shared his personal opinion. Isn’t there any way to turn the tide?
[김경민]
For example, the comfort women issue was actually agreed upon in the past when Yun Byung-se and Kishida were foreign ministers. However, because it has been turned upside down, the Japanese people are very perplexed and it has become like that. Then things got sorted out, these two.
And what came out was the sale of Japanese assets in Korea, and it came out with this. So I can’t keep dragging this on. Regarding that part, there are diplomatic languages that are sparingly spoken. Our country has to show a bigger heart by doing things that do not conflict too much with diplomatic languages.
I hope to do that in the future. Let’s not do this and that every time there is a change of government. I think that the diplomatic strategy itself, especially the relations with Japan, should show such a big heart that we are going while governing Japan.
[앵커]
You said that it is important to take the lead in Korea-Japan relations, but an official from the presidential office said something like this. So, from now on, you are saying that it would be good to go from a top-down method rather than a bottom-up method.
[김경민]
So, let’s have the summit meeting soon. I believe that relations with Japan must go top-down. There’s a reason. Unlike Korea, Japan is a country with a very late decision-making structure.
If you do this while editing each character, then a year goes by. So, when the leaders meet and go to the top down, the conversation goes faster. So, at that time, I want to have a really constructive and future-oriented Korea-Japan relationship with respect to Korea-Japan relations according to the philosophy that President Yun Seok-yeol has in his head.
Give them all the cards they’re asking for now and listen to them, it’s like this. But even there, you can’t hear everything. First of all, there is a level of emotion in our people that has already been formed, and we cannot completely destroy it.
However, to some extent it is improved and to some extent it is maintained. This is what Prime Minister Kishida has to say to his people as well. It’s very complex and subtle, but on the one hand, because the US is involved, I don’t think it’s completely impossible.
[앵커]
If you want to go top-down between normal people, would it be a compatibility between normal ones? It’s also important, but what is the attitude of Prime Minister Kishida? Is he capable of forward movement?
[김경민]
That’s the way I see it, because most of the country’s ministers or ministers before becoming prime ministers. Since this aristocrat was a former foreign minister, he probably has experience as a foreign minister, so he knows how to do diplomacy.
Seeing that I attended the NATO summit this time, I tried to organize the relationship well, no matter what, even in a short period of time. So I don’t think it’s that time consuming or difficult.
[앵커]
You mentioned the achievements of the NATO summit earlier. Another important thing to note is that the trilateral summit was held almost five years ago. What does this mean?
[김경민]
That means a lot. If 25 minutes is short, it is very short, but I attended more than 30 countries, and 25 minutes is a long time. Biden of the United States sat there, President Yun Seok-yeol sat to the left of the square table, and Prime Minister Kishida sat there.
America wants your good relationship Because that person is throwing a message. So, I was hoping for a more advanced story to come out of that, but I hope it comes out a little bit more when the Korea, US, and Japan trilateral cooperation is going on.
What if North Korea conducts its 7th nuclear test? At that time, we will also fight back with nuclear weapons now. It would have been nice if there had been some progress on how to protect our country through this level of cooperation between Korea, the United States and Japan, but I think it is still very restrained. But what if this time, North Korea is really going to conduct its 7th nuclear test? Perhaps we will come up with a strategy for expanding deterrence of nuclear weapons with nuclear weapons.
why? Strategic nuclear weapons have gone far like ICBMs now, but the short-range nuclear weapons capable of attacking Seoul are tactical nuclear weapons. If you try to stop this, the talk of nuclear cooperation that our country can attack you with nuclear weapons, North Korea should be careful about nuclear tests. The talk will come out.
[앵커]
Another point worth noting at the Korea-U.S.-Japan summit was Prime Minister Kishida’s announcement that he would strengthen defense capabilities. Let’s hear what it’s about.
[기시다 후미오 / 일본 총리 : (북한의) 핵실험이 이뤄질 경우 공동 훈련을 포함해 일본과 미국, 한국이 함께 대응해야 한다고 생각합니다. 미일 동맹의 억지력, 대처력을 강화하기 위해서도 우리나라의 방위력을 획기적으로 강화할 것입니다.]
[앵커]
How did you hear about it? Strengthening defense What does this mean?
[김경민]
America is demanding. So, Japan started with militarism and ate up Korea, but it was destroyed by militarism. When it comes to militarism, it was a meeting between warlords and chaebols.
It was surrendered by dropping a nuclear bomb. While MacArthur was ruling the military there, he made a peace constitution so that he could not have military nuclear weapons, but this means that he has the Self-Defense Forces. At the same time, millions of Japanese people also died due to militarism.
So the truth is, they didn’t want to militarize again. So, what is taboo is that 1% of GNP cannot be used for defense spending. This is huge money.
Because Japan’s GNP is high. I’ll just give one example at the moment. Our goal is to have 60 F-35 stealth fighters that North Korean leader Kim Jong-un hates the most, and fighters that cannot be detected by radar.
The military power is several times stronger than ours, you say the Self-Defense Forces. And then it goes up to 2%? It’s a military powerhouse. This is how history is changing now.
[앵커]
This is something we are very sensitive to.
[김경민]
It’s sensitive. Submarines are also tied up in a system of 16 and then 22. Japan is the only country in the world that builds and retires one every year. And when our submarines go out of the Korean Strait to the Pacific Ocean, Japanese submarines catch them all. We all know when we go out.
[앵커]
Finally, briefly. If you look at the contents of the declaration based on the NATO summit now, you can see that the international situation is changing quite a lot. In the end, tell me which one you need to unlock the key from.
[김경민]
Where are you talking?
[앵커]
I’m Japanese.
[김경민]
Are you in Japan? First of all, conversations will be held at the working level, but from my point of view, it is the style of President Yoon Seok-yeol, so I would like to be able to do it directly with Prime Minister Kishida. Then it seems like we have to move like that from the bottom up, and there is also the GSOMIA and Korea-Japan Military Information Protection Agreement.
It’s also blocked in our country right now, so it’s a joke. I will do this right away. I don’t know if I have time now or not, but it’s time for me to talk. With GSOMIA, we get a lot more.
So, we have four intelligence satellites that can look at North Korea. Japan has 10. we are less There’s a lot to gain. Japan has nothing to gain from the military protection agreement other than to obtain information about North Korea from North Korean defectors from North Korea.
So, while doing military security between Korea and Japan, really expand cooperation in all areas, and release the easing of export restrictions on the head of the department. By doing this, it helps our economy. So Japan is a country that shares the values of liberal democracy and market economy, although the United States made it this way anyway.
So, I think it would be good to open up the future of Korea-Japan relations by talking in such an environment.
[앵커]
You talked about improving relations between Korea and Japan, but improving relations with China seems to be a very complicated diplomatic situation that remains as a task. Until now, Kim Kyung-min was Professor Emeritus of Political Science and International Relations at Hanyang University. Thank you.
[김경민]
Thank you.
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